Mike Huckabee on The Daily Show

I love Jon Stewart. So much.




I put the bulk of the transcript here:

Jon: ...The gay marriage issue, and why conservatives are against it... You write that marriage is the bedrock of our society. Why would you not want more couples to buy into the stability of marriage? Why would you want that precluded for an entire group of people?

Mike: Well, marriage still means one man, one woman, life relationship. I think people have a right to live any way they want to, but even anatomically, let's face it, the only way that we can create the next generation is through a male-female relationship. For 5,000 years of recorded human history, that's what marriage has meant. Thirty states have had it on the ballot.

Jon: Right.

Mike: And in all thirty states, it's passed. Even in states like California that nobody would suggest are social conservatives leading the state of California.

Jon: Thirty states had Mike Huckabee on the ballot and they went with McCain. Listen, you can't trust the voters! The voters don't know!

Mike: In those states, Jon, an average of 60% of voters across America have affirmed traditional marriage. it's not that they have tried to say that they're gonna ban something as much as they're going to affirm what has always been-

Jon: California did ban it, in essence they said-

Mike: They affirmed what they had done before.

Jon: But people got married in the interim, and then they went back and said, "you're not". I guess my question is, you said "reaffirming the tradition of marriage over 5,000 years", which takes it back to the Old Testament, where polygamy was the norm, not the heterosexual marriage between two people who choose each other. Marriage has evolved greatly over those 5,000 years, from a property arrangement, uh, polygamy. We've redefined it constantly. It used to be that people of different races could not marry. It strikes me as very convenient to go back to the Bible and say, "Hey man, we gotta look at the way they define marriage." Why don't we look at the way they did slavery?

Mike: But if we change the definition, then we really do have to change it to accommodate all lifestyles. I mean, we would have to say to the guy in West Texas who had 27 wives, "That's okay", and I'm not sure I hear too many people arguing that that's a great idea.

Jon: I don't think polygamy is the issue here. It seems like a fundamental human right. You write in your book that all people are created equal, and yet for gay people, you believe that it is corrosive to society to allow them to have the privileges that all humans enjoy.

Mike: But there's a difference between the equality of each individual and the equality of what we do, the sameness of what we do. The fact is, marriage is, under our law, a privilege. It's not an absolute divine right.

Jon: So what if we make it that Hispanics can't vote.

Mike: Well I don't think that's a really good idea. I'm not sure that we should do that.

Jon: So why can't gay people get married?

Mike: Well, because marriage still means a male and a female relationship, and until the law is overturned, it still means that.

Jon: I disagree. I think segregation used to be the law until the courts intervened.

Mike: But there's a big difference between a person being black, and a person practicing a lifestyle and engaging in a marital relationship.

Jon: This is helpful. I think this gets to the crux of it. I think it's the difference between what you believe gay people are and what I do. And I live in New York City, so I'm just gonna make a supposition that I have more experience being around 'em. And I'll tell you this: Religion is far more of a choice than homosexuality. And the protections that we have, for religion... We protect religion, and talk about a lifestyle choice, that is absolutely a choice. Gay people don't choose to be gay.

Mike: But religious people-

Jon: At what age did you choose to not be gay?

Mike: But Jon, religious people don't have the right to burn others at the stake. They don't have the right to do anything they wish to do. It still comes down to-

Jon: You're not being asked to marry a guy. They're asking to marry the person they love.

Mike: But they're asking to redefine the word. And frankly, we're probably not going to come to terms, but if the American people are not convinced we should overturn the definition of marriage, uh, then I would say that those who support the idea of same-sex marriage have a lot of work to do to convince the rest of us. And as I said, 68% of the American population have made that decision.

Jon: Here's what I think. I think it's one of... You talk about the pro-life movement being one of the great shames of our nation. If you want #2, I think it's that. I think it's an absolute, it's a travesty that people have forced someone who is gay to have to make their case that they deserve the same basic rights.

Mike: I disagree with that. I really do. And one of the things I wanna make sure that people understand that if someone does not necessarily support the idea of changing the definition of marriage, it does not mean that they're a homophobe. It does not mean that they're filled with hate and animosity.

Jon: I was in no way suggesting that.

Mike: No you were not saying that, but I think that some people would like to throw the epithets at people, whether they're like me or someone else.

Jon: But it does beg the question, and I have to say, and again, is why? You keep talking about, "Geez, it would be redifining a word," and it feels like semantics is cold comfort when it comes to humanity. And especially someone such as yourself, who is, I think, an empathetic person, who is someone who seeks to get to the heart of problems, this is idea that, "Geez, I don't know, Jon, definitions in society..." I mean, marriage was not even a sacrament until the 1200's.

Mike: But words do matter. Definitions matter. And I think that we have to be very thoughtful and careful before we say that we're going to undo an entire social structure. I mean, let's face it, the purpose of a marriage is not just to create the next generation, but is to train our replacements. And it is in the context of 23 male and 23 female chromosomes coming together at the point of conception to create the next human life.

Jon: I think you're looking at sexuality and not attributes, and I think it's odd because the conservative mantra is "Ameritocracy", and I think what you're suggesting is, the fact of being gay parents makes you not as good as others. And I would suggest that a loving, gay family with a financially secure background beats the hell out of Britney Spears and Kevin Federline any day of the week.

Mike: I'm not gonna defend Britney and Kevin.

Jon: But I appreciate you having the conversation. And uh, I just, it's, it's just- it's wild.

Mike: Well Jon, I just want you to know, I'm not gonna marry you.

Jon: I appreciate that.